Please enjoy this transcript of this episode with Shawn Lovejoy, Founder & CEO Of Courage To Lead. It was transcribed and therefore might contain a few typos.
Shawn Lovejoy: 00:00 This morning, 6:00 AM my church is 21 days of prayer. I’m praying and allowing God to bring me back to why I’m doing what I’m doing. I never want to be driven by the what. I was going to be driven by the why, but then we’ve got to get everyone in our organization to that. That’s the great challenging enterprise of leadership.
Doug Smith: 00:18 This is the L3 Leadership podcast, episode number 180.
Doug Smith: 00:25 What’s up everyone and welcome to another episode of the L3 Leadership podcast. My name is Doug Smith and I’m the founder of L3 Leadership. In this episode, you’re going to get to hear my lightning round interview with Shawn Lovejoy. Sean is the founder and CEO of Courage to Lead, a coaching company that coaches leaders through what keeps them up at night. I love that tagline and this specific episode you’re going to get to your Shawn talk about some of his favorite books, podcasts, and habits. You’ll hear his advice or his 20-year-old self and so much more, and again, you can go back and listen to part one of our interview in episode number 179 and I would highly encourage you to do that. But before we dive into the lightning round, just a few announcements. I want to encourage all of you to become members of L3 Leadership.
Doug Smith: 01:01 Our vision here is very simple. We want to connect and develop leaders to help them maximize their potential and we believe that every leader needs a group of leaders around them that will encourage them, challenge them and hold them accountable and that is exactly what we provide here at l three leadership. When you become a member, you’ll have the ability to join or launch one of our mastermind groups, your vaccines, to our community of over 100 leaders and you’ll have access to the tools and resources you need to take your life and leadership to the next level. You can learn more about membership and everything that we offer at L3leadership.org/membership I also want to thank our sponsor, Alex Tulandin, who is a full-time realtor at Keller Williams Realty and if you’re looking to buy or sell a house in the Pittsburgh market, Alex is your guy. He’s a member in a supportive role, L3 Leadership and he would love the opportunity to connect with you. You can find out more and connect with Alex at pittsburghpropertyshowcase.com with that being said, let’s dive right into the lightning round and I’ll be back at the end with a few announcements. What is a belief or behavior that has changed?
Shawn Lovejoy: 01:58 Make eye contact and smile. You know, if you’re a, it’s another class they don’t teach you and then just by how to be a warm kind and gentle person. I think you asked a question earlier about a lot of these mentors like I took an interest in people and I was approachable and I smiled and I made eye contact. I shook hands, I wanted to know about them. I did everything I could to invest in the relationship to care for them. And you know, I think it’s something we don’t know how to do well, in general, these days it’s all about us. And I hear a young leader site, well I’m looking at making a move because I’m just not really being poured into, you know where I’m at and I’m just looking for somebody to kind of invest into me, you know?
Shawn Lovejoy: 02:42 And you just hear that first-person pronoun in several variations, you know, just a lot of times at a couple of sentences versus you know what, it’s not about me. It’s not about me. You know, I need to, I need to work hard at just caring about people. And if you do, honestly, transparently, you will usually invest into the relationship more than the other person. And of course, you and I know in marriage, can I, if I wait to be met 50/50 you know that that’s a long dance, you know what I’m saying? I just need to be 100%. Honestly, it’d be 100% in whether I feel like on this day or not. It’s all being reciprocated at my imperfect standard. You know, I just need to be all in investing in that relationship. And over time you earn trust. Over time you earn, you know, that investment and you know from another, from another person.
Doug Smith: 03:36 That’s so good. If you could put a quote on a billboard for everyone to read, what would it say?
Shawn Lovejoy: 03:41 Oh Gosh. I would probably say be mean about division.
Doug Smith: Oh yeah.
Shawn Lovejoy: It’s not a big fan of vision statements. You know, there’s just on a piece of paper, most visions get hijacked in. Everyone starts with a vision. If you finish with one, it’s stay true to the vision. When I handed off the baton of my ministry, I was most proud of three things. I’d stay true to the vision. My wife liked me and my kids love the church because I had fought and taken on scars to stay true to the vision.
Doug Smith: 04:24 So I meant to cover this earlier, and I apologize for not, but so you wrote a book called Be Mean to the Vision. Can you see me talk about that? Why did you write it? I know you kind of just gave us a little intro to it, but why did you write it and what’s it about?
Shawn Lovejoy: 04:36 Yeah, of course. I’ll say, you know from the first few sentences that if you bought this book thinking I’m going to give you a license to be a mean leader. That’s not the purpose of this book. And I know some mean leaders on this and many pastors you do too. I’m not talking about that. You know the word mean the way we use it most often has another definition. The dictionary, what the word means. It implies intent. You know what I meant to say was or I meant that as a compliment. So I’m really talking about being intentional about the vision, every day. One, I’ve got to keep the vision alive in me. Visional leaks in me, you know, if I forget why I’m doing what I’m doing, I’ll lose my vision this morning. 6:00 AM my church is 21 days of prayer. I’m praying and allowing God to bring me back to why I’m doing what I’m doing. I never want to be driven by the what. I was going to be driven by the why, but then we’ve got to get everyone in our organization to that. That’s the great challenging enterprise of leadership. So that whole book was really the culmination of like 10 years of coaching. How to stay true to the vision, how to get the vision, you know, drill down to every layer of the organization.
Doug Smith: 05:43 That’s great. I’ll include a link to that in the show notes as well for everyone to check out. We’ve talked a lot about books. What books, what books you find yourself giving away most often?
Shawn Lovejoy: 05:55 Oh Lord. I would say the one I talk about the most and I encourage people to read, it’s required reading for every new hire by Dave Ramsey. He told me about this book 10 years ago, had never heard of it called Rhinoceros Success. You’ve probably read it, but the whole base of the book is, you know, here’s how you be successful in life. You have two-inch thick skin and you wake up every day just ready to charge. You know, that’s all you got to do in life. And I really think that’s just, there’s a lot of truth to that. And it really dovetails into what I said earlier by not quitting, not taking things so personally, not withdrawing, you know, being played the role of a victim, you know, whatever. Just have thicker skin and get up and charge again and you’ll be alright. You’ll be alright.
Doug Smith: 06:43 Yeah. Have you listened to the audiobook of that?
Shawn Lovejoy: No, I have not.
Doug Smith: Yeah, it’s worth listening to. The author reads it and he is very energetic.
Shawn Lovejoy: Oh, that’s great. That’s a good tip.
Doug Smith: Yeah. I took a few of our mastermind group leaders stood and it was so funny. Either people absolutely hated the book and couldn’t take her like they thought it was too cheesy or the people loved it and got like Rhino cufflinks and paintings of rhinos in their house. So it’s a fantastic book.
Shawn Lovejoy: 07:08 I love it. Yeah. Big Fan.
Doug Smith: 07:10 That’s great. What podcasts do you find yourself listening to these days if you listen?
Shawn Lovejoy: 07:15 Yeah, so two of my great friends, you know, I’ll listen to religiously carry new hall, the Carey Neiuwhof’s leadership podcast. What does he have, 5 million downloads now he’s everywhere? And then Chris Brown’s True Stewardship. He’s also a very close personal friend of mine. You know, he’s up to Kajillion, you know, downloads there. Dave Ramsey, the team at Dave Ramsey, they’re two of my favorite, you know, Donald Miller’s StoryBrand marketing podcasts is brilliant. You know, I don’t know Donald personally, but it’s a brilliant, brilliant podcast. Those are a few of my favorites.
Doug Smith: 07:49 Oh, fantastic. What are your favorite questions to ask leaders when you spend time with Andy Stanley’s of the world? What do you find yourself fast?
Shawn Lovejoy: 07:58 You know, what’s your, that’s how I got that’s how I got the gold out of Craig Groeschel. You know, what’s, what’s your number one priority this year? I think it was Ed Young who also got to spend some time with and young junior in the early years of his ministry. You know, he said if you asked the right questions, you get the right answers, you know? So it, it is just really trying to ask questions and getting to know people. How are you doing? I have one, I had a famous leader told me this a few months ago that what, you know, sort of galvanized our relationship with our first conversation. I said, how are you doing? And then before he could answer us, didn’t know really, really, you know, how are you doing? I want you to know I’m a safe person and I care. And if you’re going to invest in a mile life, I want to invest in yours, at least by praying for you. So stays with me. Tell me how you’re doing really. And that I’ve had some amazing conversations on the hills of that kind of dialogue. Oh, okay. Now. Now that we’ve established this is a safe person and he really gives a hoot, I might actually talk to him about what’s on my heart and what I’m dreaming about.
Doug Smith: 09:04 I have to ask you now if you don’t mind, what’s your number one priority this year?
Shawn Lovejoy: 09:08 It’s to grow in my own personal development as a leader. You know, I think, you know, as we grow and we find success, our tendency is to lean upon our past. Success is an experience. You know, I want to grow in knowledge and wisdom this year, so I usually read about 26 books, you know, every year I’ve doubled that. This year I want to read 52 books, which is a book a week, you know, which is aggressive, but a few weeks in as of the recording of this podcast, you know, I am, I’m on pace.
Doug Smith: 09:45 Wow! Are you a paper book guy or audio, or both?
Shawn Lovejoy: I’m Kindle, a hundred percent.
Doug Smith: 09:49 Kindle, okay.
Shawn Lovejoy: I’ve ordered two books that I could not find in a digitally that are a bit older books, but I’m, I’m pretty much 100% Kindle.
Doug Smith: Wow.
Doug Smith: 10:00 That’s awesome. Do you have any unusual habits, disciplines, or routines that, that help you be effective, that are outside of the ordinary of what most leaders mentioned?
Shawn Lovejoy: 10:09 I coach about this, but I, I tell leaders all the time, rob your sleep instead of rob your family. So I would rather get up, you know, if I’ve got a, I mean, let’s just be honest, success is not a 40 hour work week. It’s not, you know, so how do you do it without killing your family? I’d always rather get up earlier and spend my time alone with God, start working early and be done early. Like I alluded to with Craig than I had take it into six, seven, take my laptop home, you know, take my laptop to bed with me like some leaders. Do, you know, all that hogwash. That’s really good for the intimacy in your marriage to take your laptop to bed with you. You know what I’m saying? So I, I’d rather rob my sleep than rob, my family, and I try to roll that way. So if I’m, if I’m in an intense season, I don’t believe in balance. I don’t even think balance is biblical or possible. It’s more rhythm intensity followed by rest, intensity followed by rest. You know, within those intense seasons. I really get up early and go, but still shut down at five o’clock and go be with my family.
Doug Smith: 11:15 That’s good. What’s the best purchase you’ve made in the past year for $100 or less?
Shawn Lovejoy: 11:19 Oh my gosh, that’s a tough, tough question. For $100 or less, what’s the best purchase I’ve made? Trying to think. I bet. Let me pass on that one. I’ll come. I’ll come back and surprise you in a moment with that one.
Doug Smith: 11:34 Let’s see. If you go back to your 20-year-old self and have coffee with them, what would you say?
Shawn Lovejoy: 11:38 Patience. Patience, The p-word. We tend to overestimate what we can do in a short period of time. You know, underestimate what we can do in a long period of time. I tell leaders in their twenties and thirties all the time, it’s much more about what God wants to do in you right now than three. I know you want to change the world. When you get 40, you might be ready. Until then just let God work in you and on you.
Doug Smith: 12:09 That’s awesome. And one day, looking back on your life, what do you want when you want to be a member for what do you want your legacy to be?
Shawn Lovejoy: 12:15 Healthy. That I was healthy. I was healthy relationally, emotionally, spiritually, physically. You know that, that there was a, there wasn’t a gap between who I claim to be and what I was. There wasn’t a difference in the Shawn Lovejoy on stage and the one who in person backstage, you know, whatever. He was a very healthy leader just as he was.
Doug Smith: 12:40 I love that. Are there any, is there anything else that you’re working on that you’re excited about that you could share with the audience or other ways they can connect with you?
Shawn Lovejoy: 12:47 Sure. Yeah. It might even be out by the time of this recording, but we’re working on an online assessment at gearsofgrowth.com if you go there today, it’s not live yet, but it’s going to allow people to assess their organization. Along those three gears of growth culture, team, and systems. We’re really excited about that. We’ve been using that for years and our initial conversations with our clients, but pretty soon anybody’s going to be able to go out there across the world and assess their own organization and those three complimentary gears, so we’re really excited about that coming up this year, gearsofgrowth.com that’s going to be, it’s free. It’s free.
Doug Smith: 13:26 Awesome. I’ll include a link to that as well. Everything you talked about and that’s it. That’s it for my questions so I’ll just leave it open-ended again. Anything else you want to say before we wrap up?
Shawn Lovejoy: 13:35 No man. Just respect what you do and we’re of the same heart and appreciate your heart for leaders.
Doug Smith: 13:43 Hey everyone. Thank you so much for listening to our lightning round interview with Shawn Lovejoy. You can find ways to connect with Sean and links to everything that we discussed in our show notes at L3leadership.org/180. Again, you can also go back and listen to part one of our interview in episode 179 and if you enjoyed this, I promise you, you enjoy that. It was fantastic. So go back and listen to that. As soon as you get a chance. I want to thank our sponsor Henne Jewelers. They’re jeweler, owned by my friend and mentor, John Henne and my wife Laura and I got our engagement and wedding rings through Henne Jewelers. And we just think they’re an incredible company. Not only do they have great jewelry, but they also invest in people. They give every engaged couple a book to help them prepare for their marriage.
Doug Smith: 14:20 And John has personally had been invested in me as a leader, a dad, and a husband now for years. So if you’re in need of a good jeweler, check out Hennejewelers.com as always, if you enjoy this podcast, it would mean the world to us if you would subscribe. And leave a rating and review on iTunes and help us spread the word and share on social media. It really does help us get the visibility of this podcast out. So thank you so much and thanks for being a listener. I never take one of you for granted. And lastly, if you want to stay up to date with everything we’re doing here at l three leadership, you can simply sign up for email lists@lthreeleadership.org as I like to end with a quote, and I’ll quote Craig Groeschel today. He said this, he said, “Don’t give up. Press on today’s sacrifices leads to tomorrow’s accomplishments.” Thanks for listening and being a part of L3 Leadership. Laura, and I appreciate you so much and we’ll talk to you next episode.
